What is BDSM?

What do Church and the BDSM community have in common?

How can BDSM benefit trauma victims?

IS BDSM safe for sex addicts?

Is BDSM a form of therapy?

How different is BDSM from what is perceived by the public?

On A Conversation with Joshua T Berglan, Joshua Rodriguez, aka Master Joshua joins the broadcast for a unique discussion about BDSM, sexuality, trauma, power, relationships, sex and God.

Follow Joshua Rodriquez’s journey 



Thank you for watching A Conversation with Joshua T Berglan and Joshua Rodriguez on the Live Mana Network!

The Live Mana Network is broadcast all over the world on your favorite streaming audio and video platforms like Apple TV, ROKU, Amazon Fire, and iTunes. You can also find us on Google News, and other print mediums.

Thank you for being here!

With love,

Joshua T Berglan


Joshua T Berglan 0:00
What’s up everybody? My name is Joshua and welcome to a conversation with Joshua, T Berglan. I’m going to take a deep breath now. Actually, I breathe out deeply. Maybe I should do that inward. Wow. Today you’re about to find out why I’m called a shock jock evangelist. I didn’t get myself that I took it as a compliment. Because when I grew up, dreaming about being a talk show host, you know, Opie and Anthony Howard Stern, Don Imus, Oprah was a fan of talk shows, and I was a fan of shock jocks. I just never thought I thought that I would be a sharp Jesus. But nonetheless, here we are. And one that we pride ourselves here at the live mon network. And you can find Dan Gump. And when that barcode there, you can find information about our ministry, our nonprofit media organization, our broadcast network, the links to all of our networks. And also if you want to sow into what we’re doing, you can do that there too. But one of the things that when we set out with this journey, and this mission that we felt God was leading us on, was to redefine church. And part of redefining the church is making room for the people that aren’t usually welcome in the church. And I know they say it’s a hospital senators, but from my experience, well, they want you in there. And then as soon as you, you know, you join people forget about you, or the minute you decide that you want to go try another church, all those people that pretend to be your friends are no longer your friends. That’s been my experience. I can’t say it’s your experience, but it’s been mine. And so instead of kicking and screaming and wanting to go tear down the walls of all the physical church buildings in the world, we decided that we were going to redefine church, because I believe that God has a purpose for everybody, and God uses everybody where they’re at. And I’ve seen, you know, book, this makes people uncomfortable when I say this, but this is also true. The devil doesn’t do anything that God doesn’t give them permission to do. In fact, the devil and God worked together. So the evil that happens in your life, the problems, the struggle is all of these things. We blame the devil a lot. But not the fact is that he’s in partnership with God, and what does that matter? I think our relationship with evil, our relationship with things that we claim are evil. And I believe that our just a relationship with God and general is been a little bit distorted. And, and religion has made people freaking crazy. It’s just made them crazy. And again, I’m not the religious type, I just love Jesus. But as you know, one of the things that we do here on this on this broadcast in my other broadcast, is that we do things a little bit, a little bit different. Instead of just closing off the walls and saying you can only speak here if you’re a believer, we open the platform to all beliefs. Why? Because frankly, I believe if any religious person or any believer, any Christian, any Muslim, any atheist, any Buddhist, any Hindu, any of that, I think if they were being honest, they would look, they would say that they don’t fully understand everything. They don’t they have more questions than answers. In fact, they, they they love, they may love the religion and their god but they’re peeking over and other people’s religions go on. Kind of like that, or not really offends me. One of the things that I’ve noticed and one of the things that I’m more the most proud of, on these broadcast is that I with everything, and being authentic about my struggles, where I’m at and beyond, I’ve shared openly that is I battled my sexuality. For years, I was a 20 year Chem sex addict. I’ve done about everything under the sun, when it comes to sex and debauchery and evil, and again, chem sex and black, black magic, sex crap, just like I mean, I dabbled in all of it. Because I was broke.

And when I gave my life to the Lord, I didn’t just immediately give up these passions, these desires. And frankly, the confusion didn’t even really go away. In fact, as I’ve said before, I wasn’t even 100% that God loved me 100% Because I was still feeling guilt, and still feeling shame, because I still have these desires. Were these desires because I programmed myself and I just got used to a how do you say it a more risk a sexual lifestyle? I don’t know. Maybe I train my brain one way. I will tell you that as my relationship with the Lord has grown. My impulses have I’ve been able to control them much better. In fact, I’ve had more maturity in this area. But that said, I would be lying to you if I told you that I didn’t still have some of the same sexual desires that I have. Again, it just doesn’t control me. Now this has been quite the journey. But one thing I want to say is the reason why we talk about subjects that we’ve had drag queens on. We’ve had people that we’ve had gay pastors, we’ve had people from all walks of life here, we’ve had Muslims here. And we will continue to open our doors to anybody. But because we want to have conversations that other people won’t have, so that we can have a better understanding. Anything that we talk about on the show, or any guests that we have one does not necessarily mean that we flat out 100% agree with everything they say. But what I have learned is that there’s a lot more commonality than most people would want to admit, when we talk to people with different belief systems. One of the things that I think is a problem in the church is that we have a lot of people living in the closet. We have a lot of people in the closet with shame we have a lot of people with in the closet with guilt. We have a lot of people that are cheating on their spouses with somebody of the same sex. We have other people that have strange fetishes, but they are not strange. It’s not even strange. It’s not even say it’s strange. I don’t want to say that because that’s not fair. Because believe me, I get some weird stuff. But we have this conversation is going to be so fascinating anyway. But I know that there’s a lot of oppressed people in the church. Because once they gave their life to the Lord, they didn’t have, you know, the things that they thought were gonna go away, didn’t go away, and they still have their curiosity. They still have their fetishes then. And what that happens is, because they tried to suppress it so much, they end up doing it worse than they were going to do before. And so we have these preachers, and we have people deacons, and we have these men and women of God that are sneaking around on sex apps and other things, because they don’t know how to deal with their sexual appetite or what they’re desiring. And instead, what they hear from the pulpit is you’re going to hell. Sex is wrong. sex outside of marriage is wrong, same sex is wrong, you’re going to hell it but all the things and you know, and I know what the Bible says about a lot of this stuff I do. But that doesn’t mean I’m not going to have the conversations, especially when I’m not a saint myself. So these conversations get to happen, because the church won’t have them and dadgummit. To me, it’s their responsibility to have them, especially when there’s pastors that are leading double lives, because they can’t control their sexual appetite. There’s a reason for it. There’s always a reason there’s an underlying reason for it. So today, we have I fell in love with this guy, like immediately his email to me when we got introduced when he was, you know, talking about coming on the show. Immediately, I just I knew that we had to do this. And I don’t even know how his name or he’s known in the s&m community as master Joshua. But his name is Joshua Rodriguez. And he has something to say. And I think and I believe, regardless of what most of the Christian community will say, I believe this conversation is going to bring healing for a lot of people and it may not even come in the form of you agreeing. Because what happens is when we get into our religions, we get put in a box and then we’re put in that box it gets really hard to see the bigger picture or even getting to the root of why today I pray that we’re able to do that and we’ll do that right after this

I love no longer broadcasting on social media because I can play as much music as I want. On our network, the live mana network, thank you for being here. Okay, listen, my intention is to never trigger anybody on purpose. But I want to say this. When we are triggered, to me, this means this is God showing us what we get to heal. So I pray that this is a healing conversation. And no means am I like, you know this by now those of you who watched the last thing I ever want to be as blasphemous. But at the same time, I want to be honest, and I want to have honest and real conversations. And I want to understand. So I pray that this broadcast brings healing, but also maybe break some people out of the rusty cage. Ladies and gentlemen, please welcome my new friend, Joshua Rodriguez. What’s up, Joshua,

Joshua Rodriguez 12:40
thank you so much for having me on your show. I’m really excited for today’s conversation.

Joshua T Berglan 12:44
I’m grateful you reached out and I gotta be honest with you. At first I was like, Well, how am I going to do this one? So I it’s funny, because I can tie in all you know, I’ve done some really wild conversations, and I can normally justify it. And this time, I didn’t have a justification for it. But I when I was praying about it, I really felt like God was like, Yeah, we’re gonna have this conversation. So man, I’m grateful you’re here. I’m grateful that you’re willing to have this conversation, especially knowing where I stand and what I’m about. But first things first, Joshua, what are you grateful for today? And why?

Joshua Rodriguez 13:26
So I have a partner who asked me, What was the last the best year that you’ve had? And I said the last 364 days, right? Because what I’m noticing is, the more strides I take to living a life of integrity and communicating what I need in my life, the more fulfillment that I get, right? And if I prohibit myself from that, I’m not going to have growth, and I’m not going to achieve what I’m aiming for. So it’s like, I’m grateful for my voice. I’m grateful for my support. I’m grateful for the folks who love me. I’m grateful for opportunities like this to, to perhaps be a voice for someone who’s been lost in the fog a little bit. I’m grateful for a lot every day. I’m grateful for a lot.

Joshua T Berglan 14:15
I love that and I don’t even know where to start with this. I guess you know what? Actually, I do I kind of do know and so bear with me just a second as I struggle through this first part. I know why I’m into the things I am sexually. I can go back to the exact moments in my life and of course I’m sure there was some generational stuff that was passed on to I know why. I went out and tried to recreate my molestation and rape experiences. I know why how I the pain yet pleasure while feeling the pain How to trick my mind into being very confused like this hurt, but it felt good to. I was scared, but it felt good too. And, and that’s kind of a mind F, pardon the term audience. But it is it’s very when you’re experiencing pain and pleasure at the same time, it does something to you chemically. That can change you forever. In my case, it started at seven years old. And I went off on a wild pursuit. Like, especially when I discovered drugs, because they first it was nightmares, but it was confusing these nightmares I was having, because I’m having dreams of what happened. And as I’m dreaming about it, they feel like nightmares. But again, I’m still feeling the pleasure part. And when I discovered drugs, of course, well, the nightmares all became fantasies really, really quick. And then immediately was hooked on Chem sex, and did that for over 20, almost 20 years. The one part that I’ve never really got into and I shared this with you at the beginning is that I didn’t really understand s&m I, I mean, believe me, I was a bit of a masochist. And I was bit of a sadist, but the actual the art of s&m, the discipline of it, the whatever it is, and I don’t know how to properly label it. It’s something an avenue, I never went down because the pain I wanted to experience, I wanted to be self inflicted pain. And the pain that I put out, I wanted to hurt people with and that is not what SMM is about. So let’s now rewind and get into how did you fall into this lifestyle, this this way of thinking? And then on top of that, you turned it into a spiritual practice. Can you talk about that?

Joshua Rodriguez 16:48
Yeah, absolutely. And thank you so much for the question. And for the clarity, right? Because a lot of people just think it happens, right? Or trauma happens in this as a result of and what you had mentioned about sadism, and masochism, about wanting to inflict and receive pain, that’s emotionally driven, right? That’s trauma driven, it’s a much different approach. And it can be a harmful approach to self and to the people you’re connecting with, right? Because the intention behind it is ill. Right, it comes from a negative space. So I’m gonna go back to I grew up, I started having sex. I grew up in New York City, I started having sex at 12. generationally, right, to be a man matters. Depending on how much sex you have, how many partners you bed, right, this, this defines masculinity for me back in the 80s. And the 90s. Right. So fast forward tool until maybe the early 2000s. And sex addiction, like yourself was a very, it was an outlet for me it was stimulation and power, right? I can, I can control these situations and really feed off of what I’m experiencing. But that ended up taking over and becoming the priority for me on how often and how much sex can I have? Because it’s what feeds me, right? I came across BDSM with a partner, officially, right? Meaning I sought it out, because there’s things that we do that can be under the Fetish realm. Umbrella, right? We just don’t know the names around. I mean, you’d be surprised how much falls under it. I can sit with someone and get something out of them within five minutes to show them that they do desire something as well, right? It’s there’s nothing wrong with the desire, but it’s how we approach it, how we how we seek it out, right? So in my 20s, I found BDSM. And what I realized is it showed me my value in the connections that I have, right my responsibility in the relationships that I’m building, because if I have someone that’s willing to provide me the space, without judgment, without fear, to be seen and heard, I have to respect that I have to not take advantage of that. Right. And it’s, it’s a very empowering experience to see. You see me and you hear me. And I’m okay. And I’m not broken. Right. So in that process, I learned what self value is. And that’s of value in the sense of Oh, you’re not worth anything. But so value in the sense of Wow, you’re really powerful, because you care. And it’s really simple. If you can just hold attention for someone if you can just give someone your undivided attention without judgment, to help them feel seen and heard. You’re validating their experience, you’re affirming their existence as a human being right, because how many people walk around this world feeling invisible, feeling like I can’t connect to anyone because no one understands it. That’s the majority of people right? We ended up conforming so that we can fit in, when in actuality We’re all very much the same, we just look different, we just have different experiences, but we still have the same feelings, right? So fast forward, I’m in my journey of identity for a period of time. And I came across this gentleman who had seen that I had the skill set to control the situation. And he had asked me if I if he could hire me to treat him a certain way. And his desire was to be treated like a dog. Right, like a house dog, slash or a junkyard dog, right? Because in his profession, he had a lot of power. And he had a lot of anger. And he wanted to be on the other side of that spectrum, to, to close his mind, so that he can just be present and experience and experiences experience these feelings going through his body as it’s happening, right? It’s not necessarily what I’m doing to the person. It’s what the person is experiencing from what I’m doing to them. Right. So at the end of it,

you can see he was elated. He was happy, he was relieved of tension. And there was no sexual engagement, I stayed dressed. BDSM isn’t about sex. BDSM is about trust and respect, right to trust that, I’m going to tell you how I feel. And you’re not going to judge me, and the respect that you’re not going to overstep my boundaries. Right? So it’s like, I trust you to drive the car, I know, you’re going to drive the car responsibly with me in it, right. So it’s, it’s very similar formula, very similar exchange. Now, that’s how I approach it. Not many folks approach it that way. And the reason why I approach it is because there’s healing that comes through holding space for people. And by holding space, I mean, giving someone my undivided attention without judgment. So that they can feel seen and heard, without feeling judged. Once you can experience that, to feel whole and not broken, it’s very hard to close that door back. And it’s a very fulfilling, feeling, right to say, the mistakes you’ve made in your life and the things that you have happened, don’t define your life. What they do is, they give you part of your story, or just like these desires, and, and curiosities that we have. A lot of people walk life without even opening that door. And it’s okay, because of fear and judgment and stuff. And the minute that you do approach that door, that takes a lot of courage to say, aside from politics, religion, culture, gender, race, aside from all of that, I’m a whole person, an individual person, who is part of the village that’s humanity. Right, but we have to come back to that root of who are you on? What does? What is your existence for?

Joshua T Berglan 23:01
Wow, and how does it How does BDSM answer that question? What is our existence for?

Joshua Rodriguez 23:09
So the process of self actualization is essentially, the process of telling someone who you are, this person accepting you as you are, is a form of therapy, right? One of my goals is to legitimize professional domination as a form of therapy, meaning, the space that I’m going to hold for someone is going to be a healing element in itself, because they’re able to speak their truth without judgment. Now, what comes next are physical interactions or whatever modalities we use, those are to help the person walk the desire for the experience, right? So you have to get over the shame of wanting to be spanked. Right, essentially, it’s just energy exchanges just being touched. And then emotion being pulled out of our body for the desire of experiencing vulnerability, safety. smallness, right? Because who gets spanked children? Right? Generally, in theory, right, right. That experience brings back feelings to the person who’s receiving back when they were being disciplined for some, for some as adults, it’s, it’s feeling affection and closeness, right? So it’s not necessarily what you’re seeing. It’s what the person is feeling as they’re going through that process. So you get the relief, and the validation of having a desire that is achievable. You come out on the other side, without being a victim, or having victimized someone you’ve consented to be here to go through the process. You walk out of it, feeling taller, feeling whole feeling a little more complete because you have access that part of yourself that’s been shamed. into the closet so to speak. So the spiritual element from it is, what do I believe is happening for me? And does it align with my belief? What does God want from me? Right? Does God wants you to have a life fulfilled, of experiences enjoy without causing harm to people? That’s what this is. It’s not, you’re not taking someone against their will, right? We’re having open and honest communication, things that we’re not taught how to do. Right, we’re indoctrinated into processes. But we’re never given the space to actually think as an individual. And that’s what I do is I hold the space where the person can be an individual, aside from everything, there’s a priest, a Catholic priest that I work with, who’s been a priest for 40 years. And after our first session, I had to walk him through his relationship with God, a guy who disregarded religion from my earliest years to my mid 30s, because it didn’t align with my beliefs. So I sat there talking with him, and I asked him, I said, What do you think God wants from me? And he said, he wants me to bring joy and light to focus. And to live peacefully. I said, Well, what does that? What does that feel like? He says, I feel whole when I’m doing things that God wants me to do. And I go, how about the opposite when you’re not doing what you’re supposed to do? He goes, I feel less than, and I go, What do you feel more than or less than, and we walk through our process of connection of our conversations, of our negotiations of the consent, and by the end of it, he had to realize that he’s a man before he’s a priest. Right? And that God put him on here as a, as a as a boy, not a priest, and what does God want from this human beings? Right now to to talk, to talk and to walk the walk is a whole different thing. Right, but what’s your message behind your gospel anyway? Right. So a lot of reflection has to come into, am I walking the walk and talking the talk? Or am I just the representation of right, so we have to ask, what do we believe we have to ask, what are we? What do we believe our life? My purpose? Because there’s many purposes, right? But what are one of the reasons why we’re here for me, it’s to experience the senses, touch, taste, smell, sight, sound, right. And also, to navigate with everything else around me. That’s, that’s what I feel is my purpose is to is to live a life of peace and love. And to create space, so others can experience the same, at least when they’re around me. Alright, I can’t control anything further.

Joshua T Berglan 27:56
I, gosh, there’s a lot to unpack there. Um, to me, when I think of what you just described, I’m picturing how people are mirrors for us. And like, what we put out in the world is what we get back. But also, like, one of the things that I did, and I mentioned this earlier, is that I heard a lot of people. And when I turned my life around, and I gave my life to the Lord, and I started down this path and the path that, you know, he sent me on. One of the things that even though I didn’t act in the ways that I used to, I got to experience what I used to do coming back at me. And that hurts. I mean, it hurts emotionally can hurt physically, sometimes, pride and ego get hurt. But it’s also a stern reminder of the power that we have to hurt other people. And so what it’s done, and I just had this conversation with a friend of mine earlier today, and it is it gave me a taste of my own medicine so that I knew that I didn’t want to do that to other people anymore. So you’re the CEOs and the people that are more militant that come in and they’re strong personalities, and they’re dominating. When they come in to you for you to dominate them. Do you think that they’re experiencing the same thing and in a way that it’s humbling them so that they do treat people better?

Joshua Rodriguez 29:39
What, what I’m getting, what I’m getting is, are folks who are looking to find that feeling they’re missing inside I’ve had high power folks come to me and stuff. And what ends up happening is they’re looking for a release, like a valve release, right to release some pressure so that they can keep moving. My intention is to change your whole perspective. Right? I don’t mind since I’m not here to scratch an itch, right So, or to be fetishized or like I like to be like to see a kink dispenser, right when you walk through the door. Right? When you walk through the door for me, we’re gonna have a level, a level of equality. And I’m going to give space for you so that you can talk and share. And then I’m going to give you my perspective of where you’re at, and the direction you’re going. Because, right. I just realized, last week, as I was talking to a record, I’m working on a book around the lessons that I’ve learned in my profession in life, and the stories behind it. And in that I realized that this is just last week, I realized that all the problems in my life are my fault. In one way or another, I’m attached to them. Right? I have a role to play period. I’ve heard a lot of people write, unintentionally, intentionally. And karma is my governing power. Right. That’s my religion. That’s my belief. And what I realized is, as you said, it comes back. Right, and it comes back, it’s going to come back, right? There’s no way to circumvent that. So my answer to that was be a better person. Right? Lead with what’s right. All the time, to the best of my ability. I’m human being I’m a human being like everyone else. I make mistakes. I have bad judgment. Sometimes when I’m doing my best to not do that to be cognizant of my choices, right? Because I was doing an interview, I have multiple relationships I’m in and they’re all equally important to me. And everyone has a role that they play in my heart. And in my life. I have one who just wrote a book, and the name of the book is called Surviving master Joshua, the BDSM memoir of an unfaithful wife. Right. And, yeah, right. So we’re about four years strong. And I tried to circumvent morals with ethics. Right, and you can’t do that. Morals are the foundation of humanity’s existence, right? That is the law of the universe. Ethics, our mandate, right? These are the laws in the governing that we’ve decided that we can create to manage the going ons through ego, right. So in our relationship, I didn’t need the husband’s permission, I needed her permission, right. And it was it was a buildup of the relationship. It wasn’t something that happened overnight. But I watched it unfold. And the truth of the matter is, ethically, I only need her permissible. But morally, I need to make sure everything is in sync, if not, is built on a broken foundation. Right. And I’ve had to we have to revisit the foundation, so that we can put all the stars back in alignment, so that we were working on this side of God. Right, not on the other side of karma, but on this side of karma. Because everything all of our actions matter. Right words are one thing, but our actions speak volumes and writing my wrongs has been part of this process, this evolution of mine, that helps me get closer to my belief system, my religion, karma, and to be whole with myself and, and to say I am the best version that I can be. Two things prevented me from that for many years, and I didn’t see it until I saw it. One was affirmations. I’m of the mindset if you’re doing what you’re supposed to do, I don’t need to give you a good job because you’re doing what you’re supposed to do go to school get good grades. That’s why do I need a pat on the back? Right? That’s how I was that’s, I’m the 1% reality doesn’t work that way. Right? affirmations, being seen and heard, goes miles in connection and trust and love building. It’s like true affirmations unnecessary. I didn’t realize that until I was 14. Now imagine the week of destruction that I left without affirming people now here’s a better one. Hurting people.

I can take criticism. I look at it and I don’t sit with it. It doesn’t sit on my radar. I’ll absorb it. I’ll eat it and then I’ll make the adjustments if there is any to make. More often than not my ego says no. Forget you. So, so I I wouldn’t Look at it right wouldn’t weigh on me until one of my partners said that my criticism while I don’t criticize you, if you do something that’s not smart, I’ll say, Wow, that was dumb, as opposed to saying why you’re dumb, right? Because that’s not truth, right? Putting the person down isn’t the action was what it was. So I’ve always been careful about my words and language around it. But what I realized is, it’s not the words that hurt, it’s the person that sing. Right? I didn’t see that it was right here my whole time. And it’s like, you can be criticized by someone you don’t know. And whatever. But when it comes from someone close to you, that’s, that’s what matters, right? And it didn’t click. But when I had that eye opening moment, I saw my path of destruction for all the people, yours for 43 years now, of people that I didn’t affirm, and people that I made feel less than because I’ve used sharp words, without the intention of causing harm, but to highlight a negative action. But then he can’t do that. Right. So I’m trying to dig myself out from that. At the same time, right? So it’s like, there isn’t. We’re always learning, right? There isn’t absolution. Heaven and hell, like I was speaking with the, the priest friend of mine, about heaven and hell, right? I have a moment around heaven on earth. Imagine a life where you don’t have to hide anything. Everything you’re doing in action falls within your positive belief system, right? You’re able to live a life of integrity and truth. Why would you want to leave this planet sooner? Like we’re in like a rush to go? How do we know on the other side? It’s not harder, right? For example, you have a homeless mother and a child and the child is in a coma. And to come back to unconditional love means coming out of the coma back to his mom. But what are the circumstances? They’re homeless? They’re going to be hungry. Like, unconditional love doesn’t mean peace. It just means support. Right? So what are we thinking comes next? Right? We have our beliefs of what comes next. But why don’t we focus on what’s happening here? Instead of later? Why don’t we focus on being the best version, that being watched by our belief system, where we don’t, you can’t hide anything. You can’t hide your thoughts. You can’t hide your feelings. We’re all connected. But you can feel it. I think a big chunk of us intimately know when we’re doing something wrong, and doing something right. I think that I think there’s a difference between nature and nurture. And I think they both exist, right? We are children of God, or we are all put here to experience something we can experience in the spiritual realm or the afterlife or however you you accept it to be. Right. So what are we doing with our time?

Joshua T Berglan 38:31
Wow, you know, I like that you said this, and this is why I like having these conversations because our beliefs are different as far as you know, like, in that’s okay. Like, I have never, that’s never been an issue for me ever. But where I why I love these conversations that I find myself finding more in common with people that believe differently than me than the people that do because what you’re you’re everything that you’re saying is so practical. And it matters like we have I mean, I see it all day on social media that people are just like, oh Jesus take me I read I’m ready for Jesus to return I’m ready. I’m sick of this world. I’m done with this world. And I’m in my train of thought is well, when God comes than he does and that’s awesome because I’m ready for it. But I love my life now. I love what I get to do every day now. And I I love my life. I love the opportunity that even though I can’t change the past, I can take those bad things it’s like every day is a new opportunity to add more on this on the good side then my old toxic Evil Self and and also if we’re sitting around waiting for Jesus to return or God to come back or or the rapture to happen or whatever the belief system is where we’re just waiting for the end of the world and to be swept up in the sky. That means we’re not taking committed action.

Joshua Rodriguez 40:10
Today, actually, yep.

Joshua T Berglan 40:13
And that is a problem that humans have, regardless of faith, regardless of religion. This is a problem like we’re sitting around waiting for someone else to do it. In Dead government. What if we were created to be the superhero of this movie? What if the power was inside of us? And I’ll never ever, ever, ever say that I am God. But I promise you God has given us way more power than we utilize. So the question is, what suppressing it guilt, shame, anger, resentment, jealousy, lying, deceiving, hurting people. That’s what’s keeping us from being that. And of course, we get into the foods we eat and the things we consume, which also doesn’t help. But that’s a big part of it. So I want to ask you something, because one of the things that we talked about, before we started was that you have a lot of people have faith coming to see you. And obviously, I don’t want you, you know, reading their mail and telling their business. But can you get to maybe a core is there a common denominator with all of the believers that come to you of why they’re there?

Joshua Rodriguez 41:31
I think it’s to experience connection, unfiltered, connection without judgment, to to not feel wrong. Right, just to see if, if they’re like the only one, it’s almost like going to confession

Joshua T Berglan 41:55
with a ball gag in your mouth.

Joshua Rodriguez 41:59
Except on the other side, you’re gonna get a spanking for being a good boy. Right? It’s like

Joshua T Berglan 42:13
I hope that was appropriate.

Joshua Rodriguez 42:17
It, it comes back to wanting to be okay. Right? If they’re not getting the affirmations from their communities, if they’re feeling wrong, why don’t I go see an expert. I’m an expert like I, I work with therapists, I work like with their clients, like mental health professionals, helping their clients work through trauma. I have reached that most people don’t. I can be myself with you, I can give you my examples of this have similar experiences of grief and loss, and fear and shame that a lot of others can’t, because they have to keep that power differential. Right. But if Imagine if the priest said, Well, I got touched to imagine how empowering that would be for the for the person coming to say, Oh, my God, I am not the only one. Right? So it’s that connection is almost like a Brotherhood or familial connection to say, they’ve suffered, as I’ve suffered.

Joshua T Berglan 43:30
Wow, how I could see s&m or BDSM play playing a role in retraining triggers of

Joshua Rodriguez 43:41
abuse. Yes, reframe.

Joshua T Berglan 43:45
I’ve, I’ve had to I develop disassociative identity disorder and, and mind you, I’ve healed dramatically to the point that it doesn’t affect me near like it used to, in fact, it really doesn’t seem to affect me that much at all anymore. But it’s, it’s it’s there. But one of the ways that I healed the alters that I had, from the trauma as a kid, and really even as an adult to self inflicted trauma from others. I consciously went back. And I took each altar on a different healing journey, and I would prepare myself mentally, spiritually, physically, whatever it took to go back to the old triggers, so I wouldn’t have them anymore. And they became very, very necessary for me because by doing that, it’s allowed me to go back to some of the places that I came from, to be the man of God that I am today to be in situations that won’t tempt me like before, like, you know, living in LA I had a lot of different opportunities to work private security for celebrities and high profile people and just some random silly parties and other things, but I go into those parties, I was around drugs and sex and guns and all kinds of violence, I saw a lot of really crazy things. But I was able to remain in integrity and remain true to God. Because I went back and I read, I’d went to situations and retrain them, the things that didn’t get me excited and titillated anymore, where I would go Taiwan off and disappear. For four days straight, I was able to do that I can see this being a useful tool for abusers. Like I was people that have been abused like I was, whether it’s sexual or physical, what other kinds of triggers would BDSM help people retrain

Joshua Rodriguez 45:47
all types, I mean, ultimately, what’s happening is like a trigger. As I see it, is a response, a physical, emotional, psychological response. To regain control of the situation, you lost control of previous, right that you had no control. So the trigger is your response to getting control of that scenario, no matter what that looks like. Sometimes more often, it works because they maintain that control. But sometimes that doesn’t work either. So when it comes to reframing trauma, what you have to look at is the circumstance and the outcome. And you have to talk this, talking it through to laying out the process of the trauma is a big deal, right. So there was someone I was working with a gentleman who had a fetish for cutting woman’s hairs, hair, right. And we had to dig into what, why, like, what is that? And ultimately what he wanted was to experience the same thing, except the opposite, where he’s given a forced haircut from a woman. What it boiled down to was as a kid, he had siblings, and they were all sisters. And he’s a child of the 60s. So he wants to have long hair. And the parents weren’t having that the parents who were from the World War Two era. So the dad and the mom would shave his head, because boys don’t have long hair. Right? So he grew resentment towards women, because his sisters had all long hair. So the year two decades, he, he fantasized about cutting women’s hairs out of sight out of negative experience. He found us a spouse who let him do it for X amount of time. And then they grew weary of it. So then he reached out to me. And what he wanted me to do was set up an experience so that he could have his hair cut by a woman through this process, and I had to stop myself, Do you realize what you’re doing? I said, all you’re doing is satiating the fetish. And the problem is is what you need to do is empower yourself through this, I need you to reframe what’s going to happen. I go Now imagine if because the haircuts we’re going to be throughout this the seedings, right the first time they pretend, but there was no haircut the second time, so he was throttling the fear of having his haircut. So I said, what if we did this? What if you sat down on the chair and I just shaved your head right away? Just one quick snap. It’s gonna shock you. And I’m pretty sure you’re gonna say no, wait, stop. And then I have to stop. And I don’t get to finish the experience the truck traumatic experience, I’d be giving it to you. Because now you have the power to stop it. I go, That’s power. That’s reframing trauma, not teasingly, your haircut that’s feeding a fetish. Right? And oh, my.

Joshua T Berglan 48:37
God, you’re just, I just I hate it. That just light bulb, okay? Keep going.

Joshua Rodriguez 48:47
Right? So it’s like reframing the trauma is very important. Using BDSM, to reframe trauma, I don’t recommend it without engaging with someone who is highly skilled and psychologically understands what the process is, and understands the physical and emotional limitations of you. And or the scenario, right, because things can go bad things can go bad, fast, right? And you don’t want to make it worse. You want to make it better. And the great thing about this lifestyle and BDSM, when approached responsibly, is you approach it on an equal playing field. No one’s above anyone else. It’s just you and me at first, and then after our conversations in connection will be determined how we feel internally, about the power exchange. And then we talk about that. And we mold it into what we want it to be because we have the permissions to create the relationships we want. However we want. No one’s ever told us that. So it’s like well, what are we doing with relationship building? Like I learned about sex through HBO and Robin Byrd. Right? It’s like no one sat down with me and explained to me anatomy No one sat down explained To me, the parts of my body that are meant to be sacred, right and why? Right, so I was giving it away. And BDSM showed me my power and my voice in being able to connect with people and build trust.

Joshua T Berglan 50:15
That’s that last two sentences is so powerful. And it reminds me really quick this, this, it reminds me of something. So when I, I was a horrible father and I was a deadbeat, and a bad husband and all those things, but when I turned my life around, and I healed and I went through my journey, as I was blessed to get into to receive the woman of my dreams, that came with two kids, that I swear to you were made for me, like they their personalities are just like my two dominant personalities. And in it, it is, it is such a godsend to have them in my life. But one of the things that I didn’t understand because I grew up hearing, go give your uncle a hug, go over and kiss, go do this, go do that. And I, when I first was introduced into their lives, like I took offense, if they didn’t want to hug me or, or, or you know, anything like that, it would be similar, where I would want to go a go, give them a hug, or go, you know, whatever. My wife was amazing at saying, that’s their bodies, like, let them choose if they want to hug, then they’ll hug. But you can’t force anything like that on them in the way that she told it. To me. It just gave me all these flashbacks about having to hug someone I didn’t want to hug and I was creeped out by him or, you know, I mean, a lot of situations like that. But what you just said really emphasizes that point of our boundaries of our own body and our the sacredness of what how we should treat our bodies, this temple that we’ve been given been have been blessed with, to go do all the things that we were born to do. But we’re taught pretty young to drop our boundaries for people. And for people we don’t want to. And I totally see how that carries over as adults where we just drop our guard and we let people run over us or we give up our bodies to anyone because we feel that that’s appropriate. And I think women do that more than men, but in my case, because I slept with men and you know, everything else that walked I, I was constantly pulling down my boundaries. And then yeah, if I if I if I was nervous about dropping my boundaries for somebody, or, or, you know, whatever, I’m gonna go do a drug to disassociate completely worth completely, where I can just experience the pleasure and forget that I’m being violated by people I don’t know. Like, that’s, that’s how dangerous that is. And when she taught me that, it changed my whole perspective on my body, my choice, and not to steal a line from you know, the other things that are going on, but really it did. Gosh,

Joshua Rodriguez 53:16
I mean, ultimately, I think body autonomy is is hugely important to have a life of security and safety. Right. As you said, the whole slogan, my body my choice and everything that’s going on. Ultimately, I agree. And it’s funny, right? Because like abortion, my body my choice, that’s such a hard thing, right? And I stand in allowing a person to make their choices. I also believe there’s an energetic price to pay for those choices, right? We aren’t able to govern anyone’s choice, they have to answer to God. Whenever that time comes, right? I like yourself. I’ve done a lot of shit and I’ve been a horrible parent for the first for a long time, and I’ve had to change that direction. Right? So it’s like, I believe I have my beliefs but they’re my own. Right and allowing folks to have their own autonomies there’s no price to that. Right to to be able to say you reap what you sow period right that’s a good and a bad right have the day you deserve right. To be of your own control to be it’s your contention with it’s your relationship with God there’s nothing else that is larger than that. Right temporarily as oh my god my hair, this bet sneakers and blah, blah, blah. It’s all temporary. The relationship you have with your beliefs and how you coexist. That’s what matters. And that’s what’s always gonna matter.

Joshua T Berglan 55:06
Gosh, that is powerful. So to recap, BDSM is not sex, and that is something that I don’t know what the statistics are. But I can tell you that when I hear people speak of s&m, BDSM and other fetishes that are similar, or spawn off from that, people associate it with sex, and perversion and other things. I want you to address that even though you already have a little bit. Will you speak to that directly about people cognitive perversion, people calling it sexual debauchery? You know, fornication, whatever all the words are? Can you speak to that directly?

Joshua Rodriguez 55:55
Yeah, yeah. I think it’s all about relations, their relationship with sexuality. If generally, I meet those people in person, so I don’t get to speak to them through the camera. In those circumstances, what I want a person to take, ask themselves, ask themselves is Who am I to judge? Right. And I also want you to think about the thoughts that you have in your mind that you don’t share with anyone. And that feeling of shame. I want you to ask yourself, imagine if you were to let that go? What would that feel like? Right to not have a concern about what other people think about you that freedom that you can create. That’s what people are seeking, is to find a space where they can be safe and enjoy their body. And enjoy being however they define that. Whatever that looks like. But the freedom of saying this is who I am, and I’m okay. Right the perversion? Some people are offended by tattoos, some people aren’t true, right? It’s like, that’s circumstantial. So you have to sit with yourself and ask what do I? Who am I? Who am I to judge? Right? If you have an opportunity to speak with someone who is in the lifestyle and ask them, ask them questions, talk about it, right? Because avoiding the conversation, you’re just going to shorten yourself from information and experience. Right? It’s like, sexuality isn’t a negative thing. Sexual abuse is right? To engage in something, conceptually, is not the same as having something thrown onto you, or expected of you. I guess we have to redefine what our relationships are with our own sexual identities to ask ourselves, why are we judging others.

Joshua T Berglan 58:09
But that’s, that is the thing that I think across every belief system, is a point of contention is our identity is not knowing who we are. And I gotta, I gotta say, I think this is probably a selfish comment. But you know, the closer I’ve gotten to God, the closer the more I’ve known my identity. But also what’s contributed to that in a powerful way that has added more depth and layers to that is the conversations like this that I get to have because and I and I have a lot of respect for you, by the way, for you knew what I was about when you wanted to come on. I have preachers that won’t come on, because I am open and honest about my struggles and, and that and the subject matter that I cover, typically is pretty controversial. So I don’t get a lot of pastors that want to come on here. But I will, for some reason, I’ll get people with other belief systems. And I love I believe that that’s the way God arranged this. And of course, my you know, the whole shock jock thing is just kind of naturally fit. But the thing that is is that sticks out to me is that across the board, no matter what the religion is, no matter what the belief system is, there’s a struggle with our, our true identity. And there’s a there’s a there’s a struggle around our sexuality because something happened as a child, something we’ve heard at church, something that we’ve read the Bible, or we’ve been raped, we’ve been abused, someone violated us. It doesn’t take much to knock us off course. And these conversations like this. They do hold up a mirror. And they I believe that they help us figure things out because we’ll hear something that go was, well, I didn’t hear that in church. But this makes a lot of sense and, and like my brain is connecting a lot of stuff you’re saying to the Bible, too, which is kind of wild, especially with what we’re talking about. But a lot of that there, these conversations are important. Because if we don’t know, our identity will never be what we were created to be, we’re going to float around, we’re going to chase every little thing that sounds good. And we’ll never ever have firm stance or a firm foundation to be us. So I like this. And I, in like, in the thing that is, is appealing, and I just can’t, I can’t picture myself getting into this scene by any means. But at the same time, there seems to be some psychological benefits that make sense that I mean, it’s something I have to pray about. But it seems like there’s so much healing that can come out of this, even though I don’t even fully understand it. Which is probably really strange for an evangelist to say, but then again, you work with preachers, you work with priests. So you hear this stuff all the time. It’s so interesting,

Joshua Rodriguez 1:01:14
what I would what I would say, right, forget about living the lifestyle, aim for a transparent and open and honest relationship. Aim for that. Because when once you have that framework, you’re given permission in the space to share, because you know, the person is not going to bat an eye on or if you’re on this side of it, find supportive ways to the partner to say listen, I don’t care, whatever you say, I love you. I’m here to support you, I want to help you achieve these experiences, right? It’s about holding the space to share identity and desire. Tell me about yourself. What would you like to try? What have you always been afraid to talk about to say, tell me something you’ve never told anyone? About your body? Right? And don’t make it about what can I get from you? Or what do I want from you make it about? This is who I am. And this is these are my thoughts. Right now. This is the test though, right? Because if you start being authentic to people who have already been your life, and they start rejecting you, then what do you do? Right now that’s the hard part. And this is where the growth in the courage comes in? Is the difference between what’s doing what’s right for you, and doing what’s right. And there’s a big difference. And it’s not about doing what’s right for you. It’s about doing the right thing. Period. Not doing what’s right for you is hard, because those are short sighted goals as opposed to the long universal law right of well, they took the shortcut. It’ll come back on the backend. Yes, those are hard. Those are hard things to differentiate, especially under the stress of now.

Joshua T Berglan 1:03:03
You know, it’s so funny that you’re saying this, I, my life turned around. Of course, I was in jail when I gave my life to Christ. But it took a couple of years for me to accept that God loved me. I think I shared that in the opening. But even with that, I still had a bad relapse about a year later. For a lot of different reasons. But in the middle of this month long meth Benja was like four days, three day benders, four day benders. And here it is, I’m on my four day bender. The fourth day I just drink my own urine to keep the high going. I’m on a sex app. I’m looking for more drugs so I can keep it going up drinking my own urine did not taste that good. Regardless of how high it got me, and I’m on my phone. I think it was like Grindr or something like that. And I’m looking and all of a sudden, I swear to you, man, it was like God dropped down to the corner of my eye. And he said, I’m not done with you yet. You’re going to put a spotlight on your shadow world you’re going to show people the supernatural power of truth. You don’t get the luxury of secrets you’re going to tell it all and when that happened is like three years ago when this happened I gotta tell you when I first started coming on here and talking about all my crap and all the stuff that’s in our book the devil inside me and started sharing this openly it felt like I was being you know it felt like I had a dominatrix you know spanking me going to tell the truth. Tell the truth. And every time you know because that hurt it not only did it hurt, but it had it hurt to be rejected for telling the truth. It hurt to be rejected for confessing my struggles, and even doing I have a solo broadcast called spoken word. In it some of the things some of the things I even share here. It’s never easy to share even though it’s gotten easier to tell the truth and to talk about it. But also knowing that it makes other people very uncomfortable to sit and hear the truth. And it also in turn the people that reject or turn their back on me that don’t want to be associated with me, or publicly support what we’re doing even though privately they’ll blow me up. It’s like, that feels like going into a session with a dominatrix. It just does. Like being honest, in this world. In a world full of deception, and lies, and propaganda and everything else. Telling the truth definitely feels like you’ve been through a session. And it’s been about the truth and the people coming there to have a safe place to tell the truth. That is the exact reason I saw hookers in the first place. And massage girls in the first place. Because I felt comfortable. And I felt that it was a safe place to be able to tell the truth because I don’t think even though we do lie, even though we do mislead, even though we hide things, I think our nature wants to tell the truth. In fact, I think our secrets poisoned our soul. So the fact that you’re helping bring this out of people that may be religious, that may be men and women of God. If they don’t feel safe in the church to do it, well, where the hell are they going to do it? Like, going to see Master Joshua for a session seems way more it burned me at the stake if you choose to Christians, but going to see Master Joshua seems a lot safer than going to see a hooker, it feels a lot safer than going back to the drug house or going to the bathhouse, it seems a lot safer than anywhere else. And I know the churches, the church is supposed to be the safe place for people that are struggling with these things. But if you don’t make them feel safe, they’re never going to tell you the truth. And that’s the problem we have. And that’s why I think this, again, Christians are probably going to hate me for this one. But I think God’s using you too. I think God is using you, because I think going through one of your sessions would help people be able to come face to face with things that they need to come face to face with. And that’s the truth. Because we I’m gonna blow your mind a little bit. God does not bless lies, God bless truth. And I don’t know what you’re doing to help people find that place. doesn’t even seem all that harmful, even though of course, I’ve got the images of all the crazy movies and all those things that go on. But this doesn’t seem like that this seems like a genuine therapy session.

Joshua Rodriguez 1:07:43
Yeah, it’s, it’s funny, right? Because I’m gonna blow your mind with this. One of my partner’s getting a master’s in divinity, right? With the idea of finding a way to create a religion around BDSM. And the reason why I say that, right is because it’s our beliefs. It’s our practices of connection, right, in order for me to connect with you to want to be involved in to create a relationship and intimate, vulnerable relationship with me. There’s guidelines you have to walk live by, right and this what some people would call the leather lifestyle, or the BDSM lifestyle around integrity and transparency, right? Through consistency, no line, be honest, you don’t have to look a certain way. You don’t have to be a certain gender, express yourself a certain way. But you have to be a good person. Now, that will allow me to connect with you intimately, and wants to be with you and want to marry you and then want to create family and, and, and build a foundation because we’ve started off on a foundation of love and integrity, and truth, right? Integrity doesn’t mean not lying. Integrity means the whole truth, right? Even though mission isn’t integrity, right? So this strict guidelines around folks who I invite into my life right now, these practices of intimacy and connection that we have, no matter what it looks like, from where majority of us, right? There’s there are bad actors out there who violate consent or abuses and stuff, but they’re everywhere. They come in all shapes and sizes, and all colors and all walks of life. They’re not just in one particular sub sect like BDSM, but they’re everywhere. You always have your 10% but we should also be protected in the way we live in the way we love. Right? Instead of wedding rings. We wear collars, right to show commitment and affection. Right and some people look at it sideways. But it’s no less important to us that we’ve invested and made ourselves vulnerable to the people we’re with. And yet we can get fired. We can get arrested we can get killed. evicted, right, we get children taken away, that have nothing to do with anything BDSM related other than the way we treat each other. And it makes us no different than a Muslim group living in a Christian community Christian living in the Muslim country, right. It’s like, it’s the same thing. It’s all this ritual and practice. That’s all it is. Right? So legitimizing this, so we have civil rights protections to love the way we want to love. Because there’s no How is there a wrong way to love? Obsession? Maybe? Right, but how is there? How is there a wrong wait? I don’t believe in help. I believe that we can create Hell by being without action. I believe we can stay stagnant. If we’re not making the choices to better ourselves. We’re our worst enemies. No one out there is doing anything to us, except our inability to be actionable. What I wrote a question down, what do we need to change next, right? If you have these roadblocks people ask, well, just well, how do you do it? Look at your next problem. Don’t look the problem down the road, look at the next one, and say, How can I address this with integrity? And you attack each one one at a time. Don’t stack them up? Just do what’s right in front of you right here right now. Because sometimes that’s it feels daunting, right? It can be at the bottom of the barrel, and there’s so many things to correct. You’ll get there. Right, start right here right now. And that’s, that’s what this is all about. Right? It’s like being actionable. Being a person of your word. I have a quote, I have a quote, this is this is how this came. I was walking out the train station one time, and this guy goes, Jesus died for your sins. Now, I personally don’t know Jesus, right? I didn’t keep the 2000 years, right. But what came to mind was, well, what if Jesus didn’t die for my sins? What if he died for the sins of those who didn’t? Who were enact in actionable when the time was necessary? Right, when they allowed him to get crucified? Why didn’t people take action then? And say, No, he didn’t do anything wrong. Right. So I don’t think Jesus died for our actions. I think that phrase is being used in today’s age, to excuse ourselves from bad actors from bad action. But I think Jesus died for their sins for their sins of inaction. And I think it’s our responsibility to be actionable in the face of wrongs.

And I think unless we can do that, unless we can change our action from inaction to action in the face of things that are wrong, then maybe Jesus will still have died for our sins, or at least the inaction of sins. Right, but that’s a heavy cost to bear. For sure.

Joshua T Berglan 1:13:05
You know, one of the things that and look, you know, I, the one thing I can never dismiss is that when I was in jail, and I was looking at five years, and after I came off of the blow, and you know, the alcohol and everything else, and sobered up enough, and I had my process and the stories out there, it’s in the book it but when I said, because I got to this place of like, I’ve wasted everything, every potential, I’ve done all this evil. And, and I, when I said and I again, the process, and I don’t want to tell the whole story right now, because it’ll take too much time. But when I said my life is no longer my own, take my life at yours. And I and I surrender. And I, you know, I went through the process of going Jesus take my life, it’s yours. My experience with the Holy Spirit that I know to be the Holy Spirit, I don’t know any other feeling or way of being or, like, I don’t know what else to call it, because it’s always been the Holy Spirit to me, because it’s what dramatically changed my life. So that’s where, you know, there is a difference with us and that belief, however, I want to say this. I’m reading Genesis a lot two weeks ago. And and all of a sudden off the page, it just jumps up. And is that the Garden of Eden is our brain. And the forbidden fruit is our pineal gland. And, and so when I and there’s more to this, but when that happened, I went back and I was started reading the Bible from that point of view and that mindset, and it dramatically changed everything for me the way my relationship with the Lord, but also not so much that God is just on the exterior and in everything, but he’s also in me too, and he’s a You when he’s in, you know, everyone else that’s in here. And when I started to really fully appreciate that, I found that my relationship with God got even closer. But also, my sense of personal responsibility became more heightened, or I became more aware of it and the need to treat myself as a temple to do the right thing, to not try to hide from God, and, and so on. So, the reason I’m bringing this up, is to kind of really expand upon the points that I’ve the few other points that I’ve made about this is that, even though our fundamental beliefs are different, boy, there’s quite the bridge there to like, there’s so many similarities and commonalities, like that’s why we shouldn’t judge. Because if the very thing, the simple reason the best explanation ever is if or not the best explanation ever, but uh, I think is a good one is, if the Bible really is the Genesis talking about our brain as the Garden of Eden. What else does that change about the Bible for people? How does it change the mindset? How does it change our faith? Well, you know, what it does is to me, is shows what you’re saying is very, very valid, very valid and shouldn’t be dismissed. Because it’s very, very similar to what a walk with Jesus is when people say they’re following Jesus, what you’re speaking about, is very, very similar to that process. And it’s wild. The similarities.

Joshua Rodriguez 1:16:42
Yeah. Do you know who Jordan Peterson is? Of course I do. Some people don’t. depending on a person’s perspective, there’s some things he’s recently said that have had them off kilter for me a little bit. But all in all, I think he’s a brilliant man. Yeah. And he’s interpreted, I’ve stayed away from the Bible for a long time. And so I started listening to his interpretation of the stories and the meanings behind it. So like Noah’s Ark, right, Noah’s Ark, isn’t a literal boat, that they put all the everything on, you can’t do that. What it is, is to live a life of integrity, to always do what’s right, and to live in harmony with everything around you. Right, that’s, if you find the morals of the story, a lot of people take him for Batum that this is what happened. And this is why and this is how and yada yada, but there’s a there’s a story behind the moral to the story, that written language doesn’t, you can’t comprehend it, you have to listen to what’s happening. And that’s what, back then how many folks were illiterate and couldn’t write? Right? So why they had the stories to pass forward. Right? And you can’t like the 10 commandments. They’re like a guide to living a decent life. Right? The simple or like, the Georgia, the Georgia stones that they just blew up. My mind was blown. They were talking about devil worship. And all this is like, listen, it’s just a roadmap to survive after we kill each other. Right? The Georgia Guidestones that’s what they’re called. And like you read them there was when I was talking to the other day, and he’s like, all those Devil Satan worshippers wrote it. I says, Have you ever written read it? And he goes, No. I said, let me read it to you. And as I’m reading them to him, he goes, Well, that sounds right. That sounds good. Yeah, I can agree with that. It’s like, dude, there was nothing wrong with it, it was just a guide on survival, to the best, to the most optimal, optimal solution we could find. Right? It’s like, just their guides, their guides on living a good life.

Joshua T Berglan 1:18:49
That so it’s interesting. Gosh, I had this conversation yesterday, too. I had yesterday we were talking about this. That there’s too, like, if you listen to what’s coming out of the World Economic Forum, boy, we went from beginning to the Georgia Guidestones. All in one conversation. Wow. That’s covering some topics. Um, you know, there’s, we were talking about this too, because you’re right, when you read it, it’s like, well, this, I mean, this is not as evil as it’s made the sound. And, you know, which is going to really upset some people because I’m, you know, every with the World Economic Forum has planned with the Fourth Industrial Revolution and the great reset and all of these other things. It sounds like a nightmare. Humans becoming useless eaters as what Noah from the World Economic Forum says, and you hear about all this stuff, and at the same time, the question that we have to ask is, do we want to stop the advancement of human civilization and our capabilities or do we want it to stop because if you set technology in motion technology is going to there’s a law, I forgot what it’s called. But if you stop this, then progress stops with it. And therefore do we evolve? I don’t know. So,

Joshua Rodriguez 1:20:15
I guess, go ahead. Who’s, who’s defining progress? Right? It’s like who defined success? Great question. Right? Progress to me would be not having to live on pay rent on a planet I was born on. Pay Rent dude, I had no choice in this. Right? A progress taxes

Joshua T Berglan 1:20:35
or anything else.

Joshua Rodriguez 1:20:37
Right? To eat cleanly, to, to, to not be chasing the dollar. Right? Because what I think is the dollar has blinded us from beliefs is blinded us from faith. Right? It’s like, it’s made us egocentric. Because look at what I have, and you don’t like,

Joshua T Berglan 1:20:59
Instagram is, as well. I mean, for all the things to lust after it’s look at my Ferrari, look at my boobs, look at my butt, look at my arms, look at my, my new trophy, look at my award. Look at my, that’s all it is. We just put the highlights there. And it is it’s robbed us from humanity. Like I can totally see why people will just merge with machine. Because practically it kind of makes sense. I just, I don’t want to alter my DNA, because I want to remain who God created me to be. But I can totally see and understand why people will willingly merge with machine. I absolutely do. I don’t want to any part of it. But because I, again, like what you were saying. I believe with the advancements of technology, the further we’ve gotten away from our Natural Humanity, and what we were created to be the more convenience we have the dumber weekend. Oh, you know, I, I mean, mind you, I love not having to go hunt for food because I don’t like killing animals. But, you know, like, those times had to be different. We didn’t have all the distractions, we had a different type of piece. And if we were scared, well, we were scared because we had a giant freaking lion chasing us. And we shouldn’t be scared. We shouldn’t be scared about a cough and a sniffle and a flu or whatever I mean, or any of the other things that are the we’re told to be afraid of. And that’s what’s happened is that we’ve allowed, we’ve forgotten who we are going back to identity, and we’ve allowed other people to dictate who we are. And that’s a problem.

Joshua Rodriguez 1:22:43
I agree. I agree.

Joshua T Berglan 1:22:46
Man. I mean, I could just sit here and talk to you about the sake of time. Joshua, I I didn’t I was so nervous. I hadn’t I usually have like, you know, some ideas of the directions, it’s gonna go and like this has been this conversation. I think it’s been powerful. And and it’s I don’t think it’s been offensive. If anything, I think it may have answered some questions that stimulated some curiosity, but also hopefully reframe people’s thinking. And yes, I do know, some people are gonna say, this was sack religious and everything else and blasphemous. And that’s okay, too. But I’m glad that we have this conversation. I welcome you back anytime, like when you get your book done, if you want to come back and promote it and talk about it, and you’re always welcome in.

Joshua Rodriguez 1:23:44
I really appreciate the time and the space you provided. I think this opportunity, these types of opportunities are important right to shine a light into areas that people are afraid to look to one show that it’s accessible, that it’s not what people think, and that it’s okay to have doubt, right. As long as you have action behind. Wanting to change life. There’s still opportunity, there’s still possibility, right. So I really appreciate the time and the safety that you’ve provided in this conversation and in this space, and I look forward to connecting again,

Joshua T Berglan 1:24:15
Joshua, please. Yeah, for sure. Please tell everybody where they can find you. Whether it’s on social media, your websites, plug anything you want to plug?

Joshua Rodriguez 1:24:23
Absolutely, you can find me under a few websites, Master joshua.com. That’s to work with me directly. I also have an organization called the kink collective dotnet. I’m sorry, kink collective dotnet is k i n k collective dotnet. And there I talk about the educational programs that I facilitate. These are introspective spiritual retreats around identity. I also do counseling that you can contact us through there, and ssdc.org That stands for sanctuary for Spiritual Development and consciousness expansion. That’s also an introspective journey. A type of organization where we help people heal from the past and build for the future. You can find me on social media as master, Joshua NYC. And if any of the viewers had any questions, or you found this offensive, and you want to talk through it reach out to me, I’d love to continue talking about it, because I think our relationship with ourselves is the closest we can get to God.

Joshua T Berglan 1:25:26
Well, I can disagree with that, actually. Because like I said, Before, the closer I got to God, the more I knew my identity. So there’s a lot of truth in what you’re saying there. Joshua, God bless you, man, thank you so much for being here.

Joshua Rodriguez 1:25:40
Thank you so much.

Joshua T Berglan 1:25:42
See you soon. Joshua Rodriguez, everybody, Master joshua.com. I didn’t know what to expect. And it was I thought it was awesome. And again, we should have conversations with people that don’t necessarily believe exactly like us, especially centered around religion, or faith. And because I, I think I hope I will popularized this phrase, if our faith can’t be tested. How great is our faith? So my faith didn’t change. I didn’t quit loving Jesus, because I had this conversation. In fact, I think I love Jesus more, because I get to have these conversations. And I understand, because I listen, you know, I’ve always been curious about this. I know some people in the lifestyle. They’re not exactly public about it. But I know some people and they’re believers too, by the way, which is a whole other conversation. It’s a husband and wife. But the these conversations don’t hurt people. But what they do is inform. And here’s the thing with me, I I’m a curious curious guy, about everything. I mean, everything, which is probably why I’ve been in so much trouble. I wanted to know how to run credit card scams, I went on the dark web and learned I wanted to learn how to traffic, you know, weapons and other things like that I went on the dark web, I just found a way. I if you leave me Leave me to my own devices. I’m gonna go down the rabbit hole with everything. And you know what, some rabbit holes are not safe for me to go down. And that’s why having these conversations as it brings it out of the shadows to talk. And mind you I used to go live in the shadows and stay in the shadows, because that’s where I felt safe. I don’t feel safe in the shadows anymore. But to bring this which is normally kept in private to the light to be able to talk does it kill curiosity? Does it heighten it? Well, for me? I’m at ease about it. Now, as I understand it, I also understand it’s not what I thought it was. I mean, sure, I’ve seen the porn. Not gonna lie. I’ve seen the movies that you know, kind of talk about it. I’ve seen the music videos that show it. But that’s all sensationalized. I mean, yeah, I promise there’s some extremes. And there’s some reality in that. But it’s not always what people think. The same way with Hagia, or kitty, demure, who was on our show, who was a drag queen. And for all the people that have their assumptions about what he was about. It was the exact opposite. So this pre judging that happens, and this will, this conversation will absolutely be pre judged. There’s people will see on the surface. And they’re going to because I already know I can already see the emails. But I would suggest that this was one of the most important conversations I’ve ever had. So I appreciate you being a part of it. Thank you for being here. God bless you and I’ll see you again Do you want

Transcribed by https://otter.ai